Blastomonas Feels like the golden years of PC building are well and truly behind us. Reply
DS426 Fabid said: Well, is it really due to to agentic AI? The support of Windows 10 has also officially recently ends, which mean that some people have to buy a new computer to not be exposed to threads. In addition, there is rumours that "Windows 12" would require 40 TOPS and seem people will try to reach this to be able to shift to W12 when it releases. Note, that the available CPU lineups with 40 TOPS are arguable (e.g. no current desktop AMD CPU with 40 TOPS and the future AMD AI 400 desktop lack GPU power). Intel seems to only reach the 40 TOPS on some of their mobile CPU when it is more frequent on the AMD mobile CPU. This mean that there is still a long way until every computer can reach 40 TOPS or that the most of the current sell CPU will very quickly be outdated (1-3 years?). Taking a step back, TOPS should really be measured as a whole system, i.e. the sum of CPU + GPU + NPU (when existant); therefore, you simply get desktop "AI PC's" by requiring a dGPU if the iGPU doesn't get that number across the line. Not saying I want to see this as then already costly budget GPU's become even more costly. I think going forward, AMD and Intel will use those beefier NPU's as it'll ultimately help their margins in the long run if they can crank out more AI-certified PC's based on their products, whatever that badge is (Copilot+ or otherwise). This, not for all desktop CPU's but at least some, similar to how AMD has Ryzen 200 series mobile CPU's that only have 16 TOPS NPU's (and some don't have an NPU at all or it's fused off, effectively the same result). Ignoring how useful the features are today, having Copilot+ features on laptops but not on desktops doesn't look good from a marketing perspective. Reply
Fabid DS426 said: Taking a step back, TOPS should really be measured as a whole system, i.e. the sum of CPU + GPU + NPU (when existant); therefore, you simply get desktop "AI PC's" by requiring a dGPU if the iGPU doesn't get that number across the line. Not saying I want to see this as then already costly budget GPU's become even more costly. I think going forward, AMD and Intel will use those beefier NPU's as it'll ultimately help their margins in the long run if they can crank out more AI-certified PC's based on their products, whatever that badge is (Copilot+ or otherwise). This, not for all desktop CPU's but at least some, similar to how AMD has Ryzen 200 series mobile CPU's that only have 16 TOPS NPU's (and some don't have an NPU at all or it's fused off, effectively the same result). Ignoring how useful the features are today, having Copilot+ features on laptops but not on desktops doesn't look good from a marketing perspective. Yes, you could have an AI PC by using an dGPU. Now, the problem would be how the OS will estimate if you reach the 40TOPS and if your computer will still work if your dGPU get broken. This is why having a dedicated integrated NPU reaching at least the minimal TOPS requirement on the CPU would be wise (Not to say that NPU are also more efficient for AI tasks). Having Copilot+ features on laptops but not on desktops doesn't look especially good if the rumor of the requirement for windows 12 are true… because it means that may-be only laptop would be able to run its (as not all dektops have dGPU). Now, AI are useful features but also dangerous features as lot of people do not understand how it works (linear regressions, principale component analysis, clustering, etc). If AI was introduced at the time where people believed the Earth was planar, AI would just have repeated it due to the existing database… even if there was evidence that it was wrong. Reply
Gururu So confusing, I though AI needed GPUs not CPUs. Reply
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Reference reading
- https://www.tomshardware.com/pc-components/cpus/SPONSORED_LINK_URL
- https://www.tomshardware.com/pc-components/cpus/cpus-are-cool-again-intel-and-amd-reporting-spikes-in-cpu-demand-due-to-agentic-ai-shortages-lisa-su-says-business-exceeded-expectations-while-intel-is-looking-at-long-term-agreements-with-potential-customers#main
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